Great post Vance. However, I don't believe any program on health care presented so far even come close to addressing the problem. Socialized medicine isn't the cure and I am not sure that anyone has come up with a solution to date other than Kevorkian.

Gary, the insurance companies are the problem. Visit a Doctor and pay the co-pay. The insurance company gets a bill for $75 and pays the Doc $30 after it takes its discount. Go to the hospital and have $10,000 operation and the insurance company pays the hospital $3000 after is applies the discount.

Hell, if the Doctors and Hospitals charged us the discount rate to begin with we wouldn't need the insurance companies.

When the economic cycle hits bottom, who has the money to buy up everything? The Insurance Companies.

Greg I certainly agree the Insurance Companies are at fault however I look at it differently. Because Americans that have insurance pay very little and it is up to the Insurer to police the cost they have opted for the easiest route. Negotiate a cost and adjust premiums to cover it. If the insurer had to pay up front for some of the cost they would be more diligent in protecting the price.

Medical savings plans were a step in that direction. If all people had to set X dollars aside each year and they were required to use it only for health benefits they would have a fund of pre-tax dollars. Don’t use it all, it is there next year. If they used those dollars for preventive care v/s post disease care the cost is far less. It would take volumes to explain all the things that I would like to see changed but they would all be controlled by the individual not the government. With diligence and a thought out program there is a solution to correct this problem but it would take a willingness on the part of the populace to understand that they must get involved and I doubt I will see it in my lifetime because we are a reactionary nation that normally acts only after the problem is self evident.

When Medicare set their rate structure all the insurance companies jumped on it.  Problem is the rate is so low doctors and hospitals have trouble covering expenses.  It's become a Medicare driven system all the way through.  And the Rx coverage?  The congress bowed to the drug companies and Medicare can't even negotiate the prices it pays.  What sense does that make?

My guess is it wasn't a low cut wedding gown!

Interesting post.  Everyone has someone else to blame for the high cost of insurance and medical care.  I read that approx. 60% of the medical costs are spend on people with less then 6 months to live ( our senior citizen population).  My 88 year old grandmother had her leg amputated two weeks before her death, yet none of us want to spare those costs, I wonder how we would make that decision if the grandkids had to mortgage their home to pay for grandma.  So we let you pay for grandma.  

I do not know the answer, but I know first hand what my insurance premiums are paying for.  My wife has had lung and brain cancer these pass 12 months.  Our medical bills have exceded the insurance premiums that we have payed the last 30 years.  And the costs will continue to claim, so we are now using your money to pay for all these costs.

I know that we have the greatest medical system in the world, I see first hand what the medical system provides.  Like you, I don't know the answers, but the system has give my wife another year of life.

Vance said,..."No one in any position of authority, you see, has yet admitted that the U.S. government is indeed going bankrupt"... Vance that's because NO ONE is in authority.   You ain't see nothing yet.

Vance:  We crossed this bridge when we left the gold standard.  Its just a numbers game now, and the guys that do the math are in charge, so you won't see any bankruptcy (even if you feel it).

Dennis:  You have my respect and prayer.  Tough roads make us deeper, stronger.  Warrior greetings.

Interesting posts on this one,

First of all Dennis as long as a person has quality and dignity I feel that we should do whatever it takes to help them continue on for as long as possible, That being said my thoughts are with you and yours.

The real problems in health care are so many that taking care of them all is probably impossible, First we have to put a cap on the amount of award a person can receive when a doctor or hospital makes a mistake.

I really feel that here in America for some reason we think that doctors are not humans, That they should not be allowed to make mistakes and when they do they should have to pay dearly for them.

Next is the fraud that occurs adding millions of dollars for payments to people that make a very good living milking the system, Forcing the insurance companies to charge more and more for there services.

Doctors in turn are forced to see more and more patients in order to increase income to cover there premiums which leads to more liability and of course more chances to make a mistake.

The bottom line is that until we as Americans and I mean "all of us" fall on hard times we really do not get involved or overly concerned about these sort of things but as soon as something happens to us we want to analyze and blame anyone and everyone for our problems.

I really feel that in order to even start fixing all these problems we need to better inform the general public before something happens instead of waiting until its a headline on CNN but of course that is not the way it works. We need a few new TV stations that are not owned by Time Warner that will report the real news with out a political agenda and most of all we need parents and families to bring back basic values at Home.

That's my story and I'm stick-in to it.

Throughout my life in business, I have been taught, "Don't point out problems here without proposing a solution." During the video Walker kept saying, "...unless we act now." I find those words quite hollow, since he does not outline a proposed "action".  Without knowing what to do, how can anyone project that acting now will have any impact? Sounds like what they are saying, is simply, any action is better than none.

I have long thought that the two most glaring inconsistencies with regard to our “free enterprise” society were Education and Health Care. They are not consumer driven.  Competition, at the consumer level, is absent, in both.  To the insured, there is no shopping for health services.  There is no Wal-Mart of health services. Even if there was, would you want to gamble with your life, with discount services? The very idea of a Universal (Government Run) Health Plan causes me a mental meltdown.  But, how does one reverse decades of escalation?

Unfortunately, even when confronted with these facts, we all (including the Administration and Congress) take the same posture that we tend to take about an escalating Credit Card debt. I will worry about that later.  Then… later comes!  I fear, as Mike says, only a crisis will bring us to a correction.  I just hope the Republic can survive it.

Personally, I've lived in a country where there was a social medicine system in place and thought it was fantastic. 24 Hours a day, seven days a week you could go and see an MD. And be seen in about one quarter of the time it would take to wait in line at the hospital emergency room. Better solution to eating up the valuable time that should be focussed on people that require EMERGENCY treatment.

Senior citizens could afford the medication when they needed it, instead of suffering - OR WORSE (with a co-pay of only $5 to $10). And, there was still private insurance and private hospitals. Because the private hospitals and private insurance companies weren't getting ripped off - my private insurance coverage was only $30 per month.

The point is - we're already paying for everyone else. That's why hospital visits cost $20,000 for the night. So we may as well already be paying into a socialized system.

The medical system is the best in the world here - NOT because we operate on a private level, but because Americans are innovative, creative and offer some of the best products and services in the world across just about every industry.

We already pay for socialized: Police, Ambulance, Firemen already - why not get rid of those? Why are we happy having those services come out of our taxes?

I have noticed this in nearly every aspect of life: Every solution found, creates a whole new set of challenges. Police, Ambulance, & Firemen are funded and administered by local municipalities, not the Federal Government. This gives much more control of those entities to citizens at a local level. What goes on there is not swallowed up in a huge bureaucracy that can be full of waste and corruption.  Even at this level, of course, those things still exist.  The Larger the department is the bigger the challenge.

I am a strong believer that the more steps we take toward dependency on our Central Government, the less freedom we will enjoy.  There is no question that things are broken, and changes are long over due.  We must be careful that those changes do not fundamentally alter those principals that make this country what it is.  Personally, I think one step is States, moving in a direction similar to what Gov. Romney did in Mass. Taking funds they are already spending, and using them to put everyone into the system, and keeping it private. Of course, as stated above, there are challenges there as well, and this will certainly not do the whole job, but what is needed now is our best minds moving us in directions that will help.  

Barb:  "Something has to be done or we should throw the bums out!" The sad fact is, that this mantra is exactly what has caused us to be where we are now! Members of congress are elected, or should I say re-elected, on how much they have done for their state, in other words, how much Federal Money will be spent on their constituents. The folks down home just aren’t too impressed with a representative that has a record of not bringing home “their share of the Federal Pie”.  

Every interest group has their cause where “Something has to be done!” and on and on it goes! We the People, and all of our interests, fuel the engine that is burns the wealth of our nation.  And when tough choices are called for, no one is willing to make them, because these choices will be unpopular because the constituents will experience pain, all but guaranteeing that someone new will be there next term. Political suicide is not popular in D.C.

I have no doubt that everything David Walker says is true, what I don’t see is his plan to fix it. He said the two things lacking are the “Truth and Leadership”.  Yes, something has to be done.

THE TRUTH: We must face the truth and then act.  But, too often in the name of doing “something” we knee-jerk ourselves into a worse mess. (Like banning people with concealed carry permits from campuses, because of Columbine.)

THE LEADERSHIP: Pardon me while I lament that the remaining Presidential Candidates that we have to choose from, have no leadership experience.  Rudy or Mitt would have been much more likely to lead us through this. Both were Leaders (capital L) and both were problem solvers.

I fear that, in the end, this nation will get exactly what the majority has been asking for.  

Vance, everyone knows this "stimulus" package is ill-conceived. Our recent history tells us the right thing to do. But, I am glad we won't have any dam named after this snake oil salesman. Besides, I hear there is a bidding war going on to change the name of Hoover to Exxon or CountryWide. Naming rights are being sold to the highest bidder.

Morning Vance,

As I see it we are coming into a presidential election year and we all know that the "powers that be" do not want the people upset when they go to the booth.

In talking with people about the "Free Money" from uncle Sam most say the same thing, They will use it for a bill or maybe buy something they have wanted for a while.

I haven't heard anyone say "Wow now I can afford that new car" or "Hey that gives me enough for the down payment on that Home"

Of course the majority of Americans are not thinking about how much it costs the government, They are feeling more like its there money anyway and I've heard several say it should be more.

What the folks in Washington need to do is take a look at themselves first and start with trimming the Pork off of all bills submitted and make any requests for money from each Senator be made open and honest and then vote on them individually.

We have more than enough programs in place for "Free Money" from the government and they are already bleeding the coffer dry, As far as borrowing money from across the oceans to pay our debts we need to look at how much money the other countries owe us as well.

I think most of us would be shocked to add up money we pump into other countries and equally shocked at how much of it we forgive them from paying back.

In summing this rant up lets just say the bottom line is we need an overhaul of the entire government and to be honest I really can't say any of these three candidates have said anything so far that makes me want to run to the booth, Hillary MORE TAXES, Obama MORE TAXES ,

McCain MORE OF THE SAME and maybe an even bigger war.

A few hundred bucks back for me just means I can finally look at a check form the United States made out to me instead of the other way around.

Love and Fuzzy feeling to all.

Mike

Our Country has been bankrupt for years (I think it began when we popped the $1 tril, yet Mr. Bush managed to break an all time record to put us in debt exceeding $10 tril and climbing) but what I don't understand is how do we manage to loan money out to otehr countries while we are broke?  Why can't our Administration say to the rest of the world  "Hey sorry, guys, we're broke right now.  Why don't you come back in 25 years from now. I hear France, England and Germany have plenty of money to lend."

As for a health care system, the solution is simple: just don't get sick!

Mike, you said, "What the folks in Washington need to do is take a look at themselves..." You will turn a deep shade of purple holding your breath for that to happen. Past and present congressmen have set things up to preserve their position and power.  They can, because they make the laws.  Because our society in general is still looking for that "free lunch", state by state, the citizens are happy with THEIR U.S. legislators, especially when they arrange a stimulus check.

Your comments are all too typical, "the folks in Washington" is the way we look at things critically. Throw the bums out, just not my bum (my congressman or senator). Even if you do advocate a change in your state, it is not long until that Freshman is swallowed up in that same self perpetuating cycle. He has no power until he starts to play the game.

How to change that? Good luck there, these guys make the laws and all of their own rules. I really think most of them know what should happen, but that course is way too risky. They reason that with them there, it is better than what could happen. So on and on it goes, they cave on every spending issue that makes them look good to their state. And WE THE PEOPLE keep asking for more!

John, though it may sound prudent, if we start reneging on our aid commitments and announcing we are broke, the free fall of t he dollar would be complete, which would make THIS whole discussion look like paying a late fee on a mortgage payment by comparison.  As I said earlier, every fix brings a host of other challenges.

Hey what happened to Barb's post?

Troy, I beleive they all have SOLD their souls to be there in that place of "power". I would not object to throwing them all out including my guy. But, I am not going to throw my bum out and you keep yours and his senority. Been there, done that!

They may even be "nice" people when you meet them. They may remember the TRUTH, but they can't swallow it without a lot of salt and pepper that they have become acustom to in the lifestyle they live. You do notice how well they handle the older years compared to the rest of America?

We may not be able to solve this problem. It has been going on way to long with canidates offering 30 second sound bites to complex problems and Fox News giving 30 minutes of hate talk to discuss the 30 second sound bite.

As an individual, all I can think to do is: Plant a Garden! Do you think my neighbors would mind a few chickens in my backyard?

Troy: Hey what happened to Barb's post?

Barb e mail and she wanted  it removed because she did not like a certain phrase she used ,it came out wrong that's all, Barb said that she will redo the posting.

Vance

Vance, as long as we are not morally bankrupt. I mean, we still lead the world in personal freedom and human rights, don't we? We honor the Genena Convention don't we? Can you spell waterboarding? Thankfully, the "free press" is able to point out the words of the minister of that church Obama attends. No one should be allowed to say those things about our government.

Yes, you got my point.

Yes I did !! Gregory you nailed it.

That Pastor is a nut case, did you see some of his other videos? Wow!

Vancetor

Sorry guys, I got tied up with business and I need to get back on the bandwagon of these posts.  

The bankruptcy of the United States has been bound.  Washington just doesn't not know how they are going to distribute it.  The news isn't good but if we, as Americans, started being realistic and proactive and make the governmental people at all levels accountable for their voting and representation - that would be a good start.  

I was at DC recently and reminded them that while where we live is still called America, that they need to remember that they were put in office to represent us and not their precious pocket books.  They were a little shocked by the statement but then I went on to tell some of them that they better brush up their resumes because if there isn't some fast changes put into place that are proactive and not reactive, they will be out of a job and they were the ones that allowed it.

Slowly, by slowly, our rights and liberties are and will be taken away from us.  While there is supposed to be separation of church and state, maybe some of these so-called churches aren't actually a church but a coverup?  Before anyone starts swinging, I was raised in the Bible Belt and I fully understand.  However, exempt status' need to be reviewed carefully.  

What we have allowed to be created in our governmental society is a slap in the face to those who signed the Declaration of Independence.  A mockery to those who fought for our independence, for what?  The men and women who have given up their time with their families or have lost loved ones for another country not to live under persecution and what do we allow in our front door?  

We are borrowing money from third world countries at an unreal interest rate!  We need to stop spending, stop bailing out other countries when we can't even help ourselves!  Here's something that we need to learn and understand:  We are Americans.  The Land of Opportunity and Freedom but within the proper legal constraints.  We cannot help out other countries when we have our own problems.  Other countries are helping us out at 15%!  Our country would never think of doing that and that what has made us great early on.  

This isn't about having a time of rebellion because it is election year.  It is about Realtors who have a genuine concern for those we represent when selling their home or helping them buy their first home.  Listing presentations used to be done one way but now I am spending 1 hour alone just educating the seller exactly what is going on and why it is.  The last listing presentation I had lasted 2 hours on the economy!  I agree it isn't about dotting the "i's" and crossing the "t's" but it is about opening our eyes people and understand that one of the most precious things we have "our freedom" can be taken away from us because we got comfortable.  

"How to change that? Good luck there, these guys make the laws and all of their own rules. I really think most of them know what should happen, but that course is way too risky. They reason that with them there, it is better than what could happen. So on and on it goes, they cave on every spending issue that makes them look good to their state. And WE THE PEOPLE keep asking for more!"

Amen!

Vance asked:

How does an economic stimulous package that creates more debt for USA work to solve the problem...

I answer:

The theory is that this works like priming a pump.  Anybody know that an old fashioned well with a pump handle on top needes some water poured down it before you could use it to pump up more than you poured down?

Once people shake their iron grip off their wallet and spend a few of uncle sam's dollars, they may well get some momentum going and spend some of their own.

Casino's follow this same principle when they offer gamblers $25 worth of quarters and pay their bus ticket to come and gamble.  Invariably, they get more water back out of that pump than what they poured down : )

So... does it work?  Yes for Casinos and Sometimes for Government

Vance, I sent you an email the other day but then the system shut down so I don't think it was sent.  Basically I said that "WE THE PEOPLE" are both the problem and the solution. The examples given are Special Interest Groups (ie. NAR, NRA, etc.).  We are all Special Interest Groups.  So we all have some work to do.

Lonn said:

I answer:

The theory is that this works like priming a pump.  Anybody know that an old fashioned well with a pump handle on top needs some water poured down it before you could use it to pump up more than you poured down?

" Its just an election give way" and will do nothing to prime anything other getting votes, excuse me Buying votes!

We will still be further in debt after the stimulus voting package.

Have a look..at the stimulus clock..http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

I think we all need bigger stimulus checks. of  $30,942.38. each

:) Oh Well!

Good Morning Nate

Your right I did not get that e mail, your point is well noted, but we the people are out numbered and have been since our government gave away washington years ago..

Lobbyist code of ethics..

We the   "Lobbyist"  of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish "Of Corruption",To  insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the welfare, of "Lobbyist" and secure the blessings of liberty to "All Lobbyist" and our posterity, do ordain and "Manipulated"  the Constitution for the United States of America.

William "Freezer" Jefferson,, (Personal stimulus package)

"Most innocent people don't keep $90,000 in the freezer from lobbyist"

 Happy Easter :)

Great discussion. I agree with Barb and Nate. We can no longer assume our elected leaders will do anything other than continue to sell us down the river due to their greed or incompetence. We've got to do what we can, starting with taking full responsibility for our own actions. If we had stuck to the gold standard and the Constitution, we'd be A-OK.

Dennis, our thoughts are with you. My volunteer job is helping people without drug insurance get their name-brand prescription meds directly from the U.S. drug manufacturers for $15 or $20. It's a tough job, but it makes a huge difference to those who need meds to survive or for quality of life. Let me know if I can help you and your family.

Wishing you peace, health and happiness,

Diana