Wow!  You have a lot to say when you speak on the subject!   I've not seen the movie, but will when it goes to DVD.

Be sure and leave LOTS of room on this thread for Gary's reply.  It's certainly coming..   :)

Gosh, my whole post is gone just by hitting the wrong key!

Let me start over.

Worked for BCBS for 15 years.  Also worked for a national head injury rehab for two years.

I've seen an Ironworker try to claim the spaying of his cat (she is a family member, after all.  Yes, I really did have to argue this!).  I've seen rhinoplasty's masquerading as "deviated septums".  I've seen mammoplasty's "medically necessary" because of deep shoulder grooves (that's one of the generally recognized requirements for insurance payment).  Only thing was, it was someone else's picture!  The patient was a very healthy 22 year old with no grooves.  Did she think I wouldn't notice the difference of about 100 lbs?  Physicians in the US try to get things by the insurance companies on a regular basis.

I've also seen the advent of liver, heart, and other vital organ transplants.  All of which have saved lives or improved the quality of life.

And I've been in a quandry for many years.  I've seen many people from Canada and overseas come here to seek treatments that are not available in their home Countries, because of Socialized Medicine.  I've seen Elders seek prescriptions from Canada, because they're just too expensive here.

My solution.....please feel free to attack and I won't take it personal.

No health care industry should be "for profit".  Not insurance, not providers.  I understand "reserves", but no health care company should be allowed to make a proft for shareholders.  That's the downfall of our system in the U.S.

Haven't seen the movie yet, but will.

Hello All,

   I haven't seen the movie. I agree we need to do somthing about healthcare but do you really want the government to administer it ?? I can't seem to remember any program that falls under the unbrella of government that works. The only one who would benefit from Government healthcare would be Politicians and their families. Sorry to sound so cynical. Just follow the bouncing ball throughout all the bills in Congress and add up the wastfull spending and most of us in real estate could retire in weath on the waste....I also have heard some real horror stories about people having to wait months for "Emergency" surgeries in these programs.

    I agree we need something done but ....PLEASE don't let the government control it. Just my 2 cents

Well I sure as heck don't want the insurance companies administering it!!  Insurance is legalized gambling.  they are gambling you won't get sick and you are gambling that you will get sick.  they are like bookies making a ton of money!!  

I would like a medical program, not an insurance program.  I'm beginning to like china's program, doctors get paid as long as you are well, when you get sick they don't get paid!!!  I am just kidding, but it makes you think.

I am all for a managed care entity.  The poor do get healthcare, and the upper middle and upper class do get healthcare, it is the middle working class that is being squeezed and squeezed everywhere and yet the middle class continue to support politicians and programs that give no relief.  I don't get it.

Shelly

Cathy....calm down....breathe.... and tell us what the hell BCBS means....

Then, do you think I can get Buddy's (my feral cat) neutering covered?  If so, please send me an insurance application.

Everyone, please have a safe and happy July 4th!!!!!   Get those flags flying!!!!!

BCBS   Blue Cross Blue Shield.

yes, you can get the cat neutered, but first you gotta catch it!!!

Shelly (masquarading as Cathy)

Oh, I can catch him.   But barely.  

I'm more concerned that after the procedure, that he won't trust me, and he'll try living in a less residential area and become a road-kill victim.  It's a real conundrum.  

Please don't "shut up", Christine.  Your view point is refreshing, and urgently needed.  If only Washington DC could/would hear....and react!

Except, about the girl that needed augmentation... Let's just consider that work "art"....  Art's good too, right?

I know I am a bad person...  I try, but I can't help it!

Well, then, if it's art, Phil, shouldn't it be covered by the National "Endowment" for the Arts?

Oh, Bee.....you are the funniest!!!!   Well, next to Mary and Cathy.   It's a three-way tie!

All kidding aside, I am actually concerned about how the woman felt before the surgery.  Seriously.  I'm sure that, just like "foot surgery", or a correction of a cleft-palate, there are needs for women to have reductions.  

We all deserve to have full lives and if we have physical problems that can be addressed by reasonable procedures, who is to say which is allowable?   Not me for sure.

Bless her.  And I hope that she was able to be happy in her body afterward.

Cathy said.

And I've been in a quandry for many years.  I've seen many people from Canada and overseas come here to seek treatments that are not available in their home Countries, because of Socialized Medicine.  I've seen Elders seek prescriptions from Canada, because they're just too expensive here

I agree with Cathy. When I was young, my first husband was in the military and that experience formed my opinion of National Health Care.

It S__KED. If you get my drift.

You could not be seen even in emergencies.

Want a solution to the health care problem?

It's EXTREMELY SIMPLE...so Simple....

a $10,000 deductible every year.

The problem now is that people go to the doctor every time they get a sniffle...why?  Because it only costs them $10 copay.  In other words, the insurance company is paying for it in their minds...but what it really does is create an unrealistic "SUPPLY" problem which causes prices to rise (remember SUPPLY and DEMAND basic economics?).

If we had a $10,000 deductible on our health insurance, then most of the every day things would come out of OUR pocket and not the insurance company who is controlling everything.  Ultimately we would be protected against catastrophic illness and injury but DAY TO DAY things would be for us to take care of.  Just like a flat tire...no one claims a flat tire on their auto insurance do they?  No, because it's a common occurance that is expected to be paid for when it happens.

Taking profit out of the health care industry?  HELL NO!  If you remove the financial incentive to be a health care practitioner, then you remove a lot of GOOD and GREAT doctors.  It's the same idea why you can't get a decent politician these days...it's not lucrative enough.  All the really smart people the could do this country some good are out creating wealth by being CEOs and entreprenuers, not politicians...

On a side note, Michael Moore is just an idiot.  But he's a smart idiot because he found his little niche in society that will pay him millions to be an idiot....

No, really, Ron - how do you feel about Michael Moore?  :)

I actually used to think he was quite a smart guy, back when he did his movie about the automotive industry...it was at least, interesting.

Lately it's just all been about the spotlight.

The National health system is crap. I grew up in England for my first 15 years of my 30 years. Its no wonder all the big money people come here for private medicine. You pay for what you get and if the government gets involved you will have wonderful future Doctors going to other fields.

Phil said (regarding getting Buddy the feral cat neutered): "I'm more concerned that after the procedure, that he won't trust me."

If someone grabbed me, shoved me in a box and took me to a doctor who then proceeded to do THAT to me, I wouldn't trust them either!

My wife did basically the same thing to me years ago. I still don't trust her...  :)

ROFL, Jay...

I divorced the one that did it to me!  (She tried to de-claw me too and that was just going tooooooooooo far! LOL)

Francy would never do that!  But I hear Doc's previous owner did.  Tim..glad to hear you still have your claws.

Ron, high profits translate into high fraud, which we all pay for in premiums (for those of us who can pay them) or in Medicaid and Medicare pay-outs (i.e. taxes) or in free care, which we all pay for.

When I worked for the head injury rehab company (now defunct because they were trying to cut corners in therapy to save money to increase the bottom line) you had to find ways to disqualify Medicare and Medicaid patients, because they just didn't pay enough, per diem.  Foot drop, of all things,  counted as a reason to disqualify as a rehab candidate.  It was no different in any of the other, similar companies who are still in business.  Go for the Commercials or the "Not for Profits" (there's a difference from "non-profit".  BCBS is "not for profit", your local food pantry is "non-profit" ).

As a former Claims Manager for the Federal Government (for BCBS)  most claims go through a system that involves no human involvement nor any flags.  They're routine.  Even most surgeries are routine and don't raise any flags in a responsible health insurance company (which I believe, to this day, that BCBS is.)  Cosmetics, transplants, etc.....all the "big ticket" items will raise a red flag and cause scrutiny just because the abuse can be unreal.  More often than not, they are justified and approved, and expeditiously, I might add.

I had more "shite" cross my desk than I can even relate here.  I spoke with surgeons (most were pompous ass' who couldn't believe I was questioning them!), lawyers whom I sent back to their dog-houses (one I even encountered over a closing table! He knew he knew me.....he just couldn't recall where or how.  Until I refreshed his memory...."Don't you recall, Mr. ......, we met at a deposition {where you almost lost your license, knucklehead!}  Be afraid, be very afraid of Sr. Catherine Mary!  He was verrrrrryyyy deferential to me.)

Our system sucks.  Plain and simple.  I've been on the Insurance side, the Provider side and the Patient side (don't even get me started on Long-Term Care Insurance....a scam if ever there was one).  

Not-for-Profit.  Everyone needs to make a living and physicians are no different.  They deserve to earn an honest living and even a little, maybe even a lot, more. It takes a lot of education, training, time, etc. I don't begrudge any physician a reasonable wage.

I'm talking about insurance companies, major health care providers, nursing homes, rehabs, etc. most of which are owned my major corporations all looking at the bottom line so they can increase the benefits of their shareholders.

Nix the Shareholders in health care and we will most likely find a "kinder, gentler Nation".

In my humble opinion.......

I agree partly with Ron. Because I am an independent contractor all I can afford is the high deductibles. But I do think these $10 co-pays and 100% coverage on toe nail removals is causing part of the problem. Folks run to the Dr. for every little sneeze, gets them off  work a couple of hours too. I believe folks should take more responsibililty in their health care and many other issues that they depend on the government for. You can afford to drive a cadilac but not buy health insurance. You can go out to eat at Steak and Ale but not carry health insuarance. You start looking around what folks do have that don't buy health insurance, toys, boats, cars, computers....when their most important thing is their health, they say they can't afford. If more folks insured then the rates would go down, the government assitance, etc...So It is you and me the PEOPLE that need to make changes and be more responsible for ourselves. If not before long you will become so goverment dependent we will begin losing our freedom in a nation built on strenth of the people and free enterprise. Think folks!

Michael Moore is a rich idiot and normally takes any of his political laden documentaries and slants it to demonstrate his socialist views. There are always truths mixed with exaggerations that make most of his work seem like he is offering solutions for serious issues. However most of the time they are designed to inflame more than cure. For that reason I choose not to view any of his documentaries.

Sicko is a good example, even though it is less political than previous examples of his works. I certainly agree that our health care system is not what it should be. I have yet to understand group plans where they receive lower premiums, better coverage, and lower cost. I don’t understand why an aspirin cost $75 when given in a hospital. Perhaps Sicko will raise enough awareness to look closer at a flawed system and arrive at a solution short of a government run health care system. Perhaps it will include prevention more than treatments since the present system emphasizes treatments as its base feature more than prevention.

Someone or some group will come up with a solution and a system that will address the solution rather than the politics associated with it and we will eventually have a system that will be copied throughout the world. It will not be free but it will be fair. It will be mandatory since the way to maintain cost is to share the expense. We can do it for homes and autos; we can do it for health insurance as well.

OK, Jay that was funny and thank you Francy for doing it - rofl

Health car is a dangerous subject. The drug companies spend money to create new drugs every year "FOR PROFIT" and my opinion is that if we take their incentive away, they will stop making new drugs. Why would I go and try to find or invent something new, if there was nothing in it for me?

Just a thought.

One giant step toward a solution would be to cut government waste from out-of-control growth and spending and do away with the income tax. I could afford a nice policy then. If individuals were searching the market for better rates rather than large corporations, you would see insurance companies coming up with more flexible, focused, low-cost plans that meet individual needs.

I agree with you Gary and needless to say I did not put any money into his pocket by purchasing a ticket.  I really don't like the man.  I was a bit shocked that I liked the movie which is what prompted me to starts this topic. I don't think this is anything like his other work, which I have refused to see.  I will not be running out to rent Fahrenheit 911 if you know what I mean.  I did go to his egotistical website.  Quite interesting.  www.Moorewatch.com was the anti-site that he referenced and it was pretty good.  Moore donated money to the founder of the site when his wife could not pay for some sort of medical treatment.  He was an anonymous donor b/c they guy had to choose between his anti Moore site or his wife medical issue.  The guy went on to thank Moore profusely after hew found out it was him and now people are just slamming the guy.  I feel kind of sorry for him.

I agree with Mike.  Any solutions on how to fund this thing???  I know in Norway the tax they pay is somewhere around 40%.  They do have some other benefits such as not worrying about college expense, and having 0% homeless.

If you choose to be a bum in Norway they provided you with housing and the essentials such as a TV.  I almost feel out of my chair when my family told me this.  I have visited 5 times and not once have I seen one person stating that they will work for food.  

Todd don't you love all those silly commercials that now have us going to the doctor and asking for the new and improved Ambien (this example pops up b/c they seem to be the most aggressive aside from the Lunesta butterfly that my kids love).  My kids actaully ask if they can have that butterfly to sleep.  We just blow them off and laugh since they are 5 and 2, but it is kind of scary.  It just seems strange to us. Those commercials make my husband and I laugh.  I have been reading People (yes I love to not think deeply atleast once a week) for over 10 years.  Now they have 5 page adds devoted to one drug.  I never saw that before.  Just strange stuff if you ask me.  I would prefer my doctor recommend what goes into my body.

I think more people live in Atlanta than in Norway. It is a much easier task to create government-controlled social plans in a small, less diverse place like Norway than it is too try to make that a model for huge, diverse countries like the United Sates. Apples and oranges.

Such a system in the states would implode in no time at all.

I think Norway's population is 4.4 million.

I didn't say we shouldn't improve our system. But I doubt European style healthcare solutions are the answer. Do you really want to pay 25% more in taxes and have our government responsible for the delivery of our healthcare? Government is not suited for anything but policing, national security and settling disputes in court.

A large part of the healthcare problems in the US can be traced back to government involvement.

It's a complicated problem but government controlled healthcare is a poor solution. I can only imagine the nightmare.

The solution is less government, not more.

Here is an interesting article.

http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=8271

Granted, Cato is a conservative org, but if what they say is true, then it is true. I mean, Michael Moore is not exactly the paragon of objectivity.

Metro Atlanta is over 5 million.

I experienced the German health care system, and I feel it's one of the best. American health care is at 38th place in the developed world, which compares to our poor eastern European countries, like Hungary, Bulgaria or Poland

Read here about some Americans who live in Germany and what they have to say:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=91971406&sc=emaf

Angie